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PostPosted: 20 Nov 2012, 06:53 
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POST-JACKING AND PIXEL SIZE CZAR (P.J.A.P.S.C.)
POST-JACKING AND PIXEL SIZE CZAR (P.J.A.P.S.C.)

Joined: 25 Dec 2007, 23:33
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Woodswalker wrote:
Ever seen a pack of wolves run elk in deep snow? Or deer? they stop killing when they are exausted or the game is all dead.


Nope, can't say I've ever witnessed that :D . How many animals did you see them kill while doing this? I have witnessed a guide telling me I couldn't go on a piece of land cause he had a guy hunting there, only problem that time was it was my land :roll: .


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PostPosted: 20 Nov 2012, 07:25 
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Joined: 28 Jan 2011, 16:07
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Location: northwestern Ontario
Woodswalker wrote:
Ever seen a pack of wolves run elk in deep snow? Or deer? they stop killing when they are exausted or the game is all dead.


Not Elk but deer yes and they seem to target one animal out of the group that i have seen. I have also seen them on the ice after a moose which did not go well for the wolf.


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PostPosted: 20 Nov 2012, 11:15 
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Joined: 04 Apr 2009, 19:48
Posts: 1968
Location: Montana
wolf1199 wrote:
Woodswalker wrote:
Ever seen a pack of wolves run elk in deep snow? Or deer? they stop killing when they are exausted or the game is all dead.


Not Elk but deer yes and they seem to target one animal out of the group that i have seen. I have also seen them on the ice after a moose which did not go well for the wolf.


They must vehave differently up there then. They have litterally wiped the game out in my hunting district. About 3 years ago two wolves got into a pasture and killed 100 sheep.

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PostPosted: 20 Nov 2012, 22:54 
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THE LAST WORD
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Joined: 14 Mar 2008, 20:20
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I read a book one time about a guy who lived in Alaska and hunted/trapped wolves for a living. He told many tales of wolves killing much more than they could eat, just for fun. I still have the book and will find and give you all the title.

I've never seen a live wolf, but if I ever do he better not tarry too long. I have seen domestic dogs in action. They kill for fun. They weren't hungry, but they chased and killed deer and left them dead and /or crippled and then chased more. I have to believe if domestic dogs can do this, then wolves must be even more vicious.

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PostPosted: 21 Nov 2012, 05:01 
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Joined: 26 Oct 2008, 15:27
Posts: 397
Location: West Virginia
trappintime wrote:
Woodswalker wrote:
Ever seen a pack of wolves run elk in deep snow? Or deer? they stop killing when they are exausted or the game is all dead.


Nope, can't say I've ever witnessed that :D . How many animals did you see them kill while doing this? I have witnessed a guide telling me I couldn't go on a piece of land cause he had a guy hunting there, only problem that time was it was my land :roll: .


I think I would have been calling the game warden over that.

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PostPosted: 21 Nov 2012, 07:27 
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POST-JACKING AND PIXEL SIZE CZAR (P.J.A.P.S.C.)
POST-JACKING AND PIXEL SIZE CZAR (P.J.A.P.S.C.)

Joined: 25 Dec 2007, 23:33
Posts: 11285
Location: Alberta, Canada
CoonGitter wrote:
trappintime wrote:
Woodswalker wrote:
Ever seen a pack of wolves run elk in deep snow? Or deer? they stop killing when they are exausted or the game is all dead.


Nope, can't say I've ever witnessed that :D . How many animals did you see them kill while doing this? I have witnessed a guide telling me I couldn't go on a piece of land cause he had a guy hunting there, only problem that time was it was my land :roll: .


I think I would have been calling the game warden over that.


Why would I call him? Surely you don't think any legal system in either of our country's would be harder on them than me :shock: .


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PostPosted: 21 Nov 2012, 08:58 
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Joined: 20 May 2010, 16:21
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Hopefully who ever the guy was, was able to run fast, duck, dive, dip, and dodge :lol:

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PostPosted: 21 Nov 2012, 11:51 
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I've done a lot of hiking, 4 wheelering and horseback riding here and have never seen a wolf, coyotes yes. Maybe I've never seen one because there is a longtime standing code of conduct here called the TRIPPLE S CODE OF CONDUCT.
Shoot, Shovel and Shut-up.

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Last edited by Musselshellgal on 23 Nov 2012, 00:36, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: 21 Nov 2012, 16:28 
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jase wrote:
This all is very far from my experiences in person. But I do understand a bit about wildlife. When looking at pack hunting canines, they do seem to target a particular animal. Across the world is like that. Even African wild dogs, considered by many to be among the most aggressive canines in the world, hunt to survive and eat, not to kill for pleasure. What canine will pass up fresh blood and meat on the ground, and instead, continue the chase after other game that isn't even a sure kill? Plus, they risk injury to continue on, when they have what they want already on the ground. Injury in their world often means death. Biologically speaking, the mass killing spree's of wolves do not make sense. If a wolf is so blood thirsty for killing, why are they always fighting over mouth fulls of the meat of one animal,,,,,, why don't they just each just eat their own, so they don't have to fight and follow pecking orders to get to eat?

I have seen many more non pack animals killing in mass, mostly mustelids. Coons will do it too. But even then with these animals, it is isolated incidences, not the practice.There may be instances where these animals raid in two or three's, but not "packs", and most of these are not the brightest light bulb in the bunch, as opposed to the high intelligence of canine's, and they lack the bond that exist with canine pack animals.

I'm not saying any of this just isn't so, but I will say it doesn't make sense to me.

I don't know anybody's particular situation. But I will say, One outfitter that has 25 guides, that are taking people hunting every day of the season, can also impact animal numbers. In Arkansas, a common practice of the outfitters there that hunt migratory, is to try and get the mornings group to limit out as quickly as possible. Then they take them back, get the next bunch of hunters, head out and do the same. As many times in a day as possible, they ram folks through so long as they are limiting out. This goes on through out every day, all season long. Remember, they have the best spots, manage ground to attract ducks by the bunches, etc. And everyone wonders why the duck population trend has been that of decline. That is why there are so many refuges now. I know mammals are not birds, but over time, I see the outfitters impacting the game way more than I could see wolves being the culprit.




I grew up hunting in the same district as the last 4 generations of my family. We have hunted since we homesteaded here. It was not unusual to have 3 elk in the freezer by the end of season. It was
all we had for meat. If we didnt get an elk in the first part of season in one of the easy spots. We just went to the harder spot and shot one. There really wasnt an "If" about it. Just and uphill recovery. The Outfitters have been here for a very long time. In the past they were the real deal and would pack deep back into the boonies. More recently the clients stay in a lodge or hotel. We dont have many large tracts of private for them to take controll of. They mostly just have the same access to land as we do. And as a general Rule they are only interested in horns. People dont pay large sums of money to shoot a doe or a cow elk. And spike bulls (spikes are illegal to kill) can breed a cow as well as a full grown bull can. We have been co-existing with outfitters for a long time. And had a very healthy elk population.
Starting about 15 years ago we started finding wolf sign. Shortly afterword we stopped seeing any large herds of game. And our winter kill rates skyrocketed. Wolves will and often do kill for sport.
I have seen it a couple times in person. And I have tracked them many many times. If they eat any at all. It will be the stomache and at times part of the hind quarters. I know a gentleman you shot an elk a few years ago. He hit her through the liver. He new he hadnt made the best hit so he sat back and waited about an hour for his partner to catch up to him. Then they started tracking. After way a ways they started finding peices of intestine and blood on the snow. Along with wolf tracks. A short distance beyond that they found the elk. She fell when they ripped her stomach out. All that had been eaten was a fist sized chunk from one hind quarter. In another spot 2 wolves which were later shot, killed a herd of 100 sheep. 2 or 3 had some signs of being eaten on. That is all.
My hunting district now has a limit of 5 cow tags. Last time I went up there I saw a total of 1 mule deer doe and one set of elk tracks. Both close to a ranch where wolves are shot on site. The owner of that ranch some time ago heard some noise in his front yard. He stepped out and shot one wolf and ran the rest off. They were killing his dogs in his front yard. We had over half a dozen dogs killed by wolves in the very populated valley floor last year. These are house pets not dogs running lose. A guy shot a killed a large male from his front porch it was trying to get into his dogs chainlink kennel. It died right in amongst his kids toys out in the yard. About three miles from his house a freind of mine shot 2 pups and a female that were killing his sheep. The female was eating a sheep less than 80 yards from his front door. His dogs where whining so he stepped out from his door. Caught a glimps of what he thought was a Yote running around the other side of his barn. He got his rifle walked around the barn and shot her. He has since recieved death threats from the Bunnyhuggers.

Wolves kill in more ways than just taking animals down directly. They run the elk hard enough to cause worse winter kill rates, Especially among the pregnant cows. If they cow isnt killed she will often abort the calf. When spring comes around the wolves will often hunt the pregnant cows specifically to get the fetus or newborn calf. Often the they will rip the cows belly out, eat the fetus and let her wonder off and die.
Im not at my home currently. But when I do I will post some links I have. We didnt want them brought here to begin with and we didnt need them. They were shoved down our throats. The only good wolf is a dead wolf.

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